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Updated on Thursday, February 26

#20607

OMG: Change my view: We should stop always bashing CECA for their shortcomings and be more appreciative of the opportunities the school has provided us in terms of coop. Many people who go to U of T or Western or etc are envious of the opportunities we have and would love to have a system like Jobmine.

5 comments

  1. I wonder if you are mistaking honest criticism for bashing. A lot of people conflate the two.

    Jobmine is one of the worst-written pieces of software I've ever used, for instance. I don't think it is unreasonable to comment on that.

    A lot of people take issue with voicing complaints, usually with the justification that it's too negative and that if you don't like things, you should try to change them instead of just talking about them. But student feedback is the first step towards changing these things.

    I mean, bashing has value too, but it's for the individual, letting off steam or seeking sympathy from others. I think your criticism in this case is therefore somewhat orthogonal; you justify not-bashing with the wrong reasons because you don't acknowledge the reasons that people would bash CECA. And there's a big difference between bashing an institution over bashing individuals who work there, for instance.

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  2. its important to have a job. wait for the best one. don't skrew it up

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  3. These "opportunities" that you have received from CECA OP have been bought and paid for by you and other students. The entire concept of co-op at UW and offered by subsequent universities is been flawed in my opinion.

    Some thoughts: people always promote how they graduate with little-to-no-debt due to co-op. While this may be true what is the cause for graduating with little to no debt? It was from money earned during a job placement (most likely). If so, are these jobs only available to UW via the co-op department, ie. are these said jobs hiring UW students solely? If one pays the co-op fees does this guarantee them finding a job or will co-op pay you directly if nothing is found? The answers are most likely no. Why does one need to use co-op to find a job adding another layer to your career? Why not find one on your own and save the money paid to the university? Then you can graduate without debt just like the others plus also have a talking point on your resume how you have the self-initiative to find employment on your own and do not need to be spoon fed placements via bloated university programs.

    Another question is why universities feel the need to have co-op programs in the first place? When did universities go from being places of higher learning and passion to becoming a career college based on the whims of business? Did I miss something?

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    Replies
    1. Without co-op, you'd have 2 terms of school and the summer term off, during which you could work. Basic math tells me that it's much harder to support two terms of school with co-op money than a single one. Competition is generally tougher in the summer too, since all other students are looking for jobs, which is why Winter/Fall co-op terms are nice.

      I'm not sure which field you're in, but Jobmine definitely provides a shortcut for tech jobs. Some companies have up to 5 rounds if you apply externally, and only 2 rounds through Jobmine. It's also significantly harder to even land an interview if you apply on your own.

      So technically, you're right; these jobs can be attained if you're not a co-op student. However, co-op makes it much easier to get the jobs.

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  4. Echoing OP's sentiments here, response to (3):

    Why coop vs summer internships?
    - Companies get a 30% tax benefit when hiring coops, but not for summer internships. This already gives us a leg up vs other programs, both in terms of employment volume as well as pay.

    -Coop facilitates internships around the world. I've talked with a few friends at other schools who only have summer internships, and they say that quite a few really good opportunities with boutique firms stateside are unpaid because the firms can't obtain valid work visas for Canadian students. Keep in mind these are jobs paying 100k+ starting full time, so missing pay for even just a summer is quite a chunk of money.

    - The real value of co-op is not in the platform (agree with (1) here), but in the relationships our school builds with alumni/supporters. My last co-op job, and the one I have coming up, both exist SOLELY because my employers support UW. In fact my last employer has a multi-decade long policy of only hiring UW.

    Learning at school- does coop make sense?
    - Speaking from my own experience (I'm in math), I have had co-op interviews where all the questions were entirely relatable to a few courses I was taking. CS, finance, and actsci are examples of fields that I think involve a lot of on-the-job learning.

    - I don't think a career-focus and a passion for learning have to be mutually exclusive. Yes, I am attending university to get a job, but I'm also currently overloading with 7 courses this term, for funsies. In any case- at worst, co-op doesn't reduce the amount of learning students experience in school, and at best, it helps you discover new passions through applicable real-life experiences.

    Finally, co-op is opt-in. If you don't think it's worth it, don't be part of it!

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